New Ultra Low Sulphur Red Diesel from 01.01.2011

Go figure this:

As from 1st Jan it is illegal to use conventional (sulphur rich) red diesel in mobile off road machinery.

Fuel suppliers have therefore made available a new grade - Ultra Low Sulphur Red Diesel (ULSRD).

OK, so what?

Well it appears that one or other or both of the recognised standards for the new grade ULSRD (EN590 and BS26989:2010) allow the new fuel to contain up to 15% Bio Fuel.

I discovered last year that one major maufacturer of diesel injection equipment would only warrant their equipmenmt for use with max. 10% Bio Fuel blends.

Well that's just peachy isn't it? How do we ensure the fuel we buy is of a blend which will not cause warranty violation?

Why oh why do we seem in this country to be totally incapable of joined up thinking before jumping in with the next planet-saving initiative?

:banghead:

Go figure this:

 

Why oh why do we seem in this country to be totally incapable of joined up thinking before jumping in with the next planet-saving initiative?

 

:banghead:

Too many bloody commitees!

And there's all the hoo-ha about inadequate food production, when the stuffs being converted into bio-fuel!

I work for a major oil company as a terminal controller. We started selling GO10=ULSD on the 1st Jan 11. Its replaced GO1000 for machinery etc but is still sold for marine use, ferries etc. All ULSD is is ADO (Diesel) which is dyed with red marker dye on the loading racks at the final point where it enters the tanker. So what you are getting is better quality fuel which has been available at the pumps for years now for normal road vehicle use but with red dye in it. The sulphur content is measured by parts per million (ppm) so GO10=10ppm and GO1000-1000ppm.

Hope this answers a few questions.

Andy.

Thanks Andy.

So the new red diesel is in fact same as road diesel (comes out of same tanks) but with the dye added?

In which case, is both ULSRD and normal road diesel likely to have up to 15% Bio Diesel in without us actually being aware of it? :cool2:

Thanks Andy.

 

So the new red diesel is in fact same as road diesel (comes out of same tanks) but with the dye added?

 

In which case, is both ULSRD and normal road diesel likely to have up to 15% Bio Diesel in without us actually being aware of it? :cool2:

Basically yes...the only difference being the diesel sold for road use is additised and the diesel used for ULSD isnt..its what we call industrial..but it all comes out of the same tanks. Im not 100% sure what the bio content is for ADO but ill find out and let you know.

The unleaded petrol (E5) is 5% bio which is Denatured Bioethanol=ETDN...it has an Alcohol content between 99.5% to 100%!!

Andy.

'Red diesel' has always been the same grade as the road taxed 'white diesel'.

Only heating oil is of a lower grade.

In Ireland the bleaching of red to make it white for tax purposes is a big problem.

Don't go putting red in your cars or road MV's or mr HMRC will have a not so polite word.

Remember the good ol days of two, three & four star petrol & Smurfs.

'Red diesel' has always been the same grade as the road taxed 'white diesel'.

 

Only heating oil is of a lower grade.

 

In Ireland the bleaching of red to make it white for tax purposes is a big problem.

 

Don't go putting red in your cars or road MV's or mr HMRC will have a not so polite word.

 

Remember the good ol days of two, three & four star petrol & Smurfs.

Hi mate..no offence but what you are saying isnt quite right. If you look at my first reply you will see that I have explained the difference between Gas Oil and "white" Diesel as you call it. Its all about the sulphur content. ADO or "white" has a sulpher content of 10ppm and sometimes 0ppm when the FAME has been taken out during refining..FAME being Fatty Acids Methyl Ester. Gas oil for all marine and industrial usage used to all be 1000ppm but now only marine use is and all other usage is 10ppm which is ADO but dyed red. Heating oil is also 10ppm as the suphur content has to be low as it produces carbon and this is what the goverment are trying to reduce. Its all about the enviroment! Trust me its what I do for a living!!

Agree with you on putting red in your car or truck..it will stain the fuel lines and tank and the customs will not be pleased!!

Its big business in Ireland with gangs straining out the red dye and running the fuel across the border...Mr Slab Murphy was one of the biggest culprits back in the day!!

Hope this helps..Andy.

There has been a big hoo ha over this in the marine world.

At one time the industry thought they were going to be forced to use bio-diesel by new goverment legislation and this would have meant bad news for us boat owners. Apparently, it's not very clever to use the stuff in marine engines. Not sure why but it's what I have read.

I think from the latest news the goverment has relented on the use of bio-fuel in the marine industry.

Do you know anything about this Andy as my knowledge on this subject is a bit sketchy and you would seem to be the man who knows?

Markheliops

Heating oil is also 10ppm as the suphur content has to be low as it produces carbon and this is what the goverment are trying to reduce. Its all about the enviroment! Trust me its what I do for a living!!

 

Hope this helps..Andy.

Andy, I thought that the main problems with sulphur were particulate formation and the creating of acid rain which was destroying the forests in Europe.

The downside is that the increased processing at refineries to make almost sulpur-free fuels uses more energy and these increases in CO2 emissions may offset to some extent the gains made in newer vehicles.

Apparently, it's not very clever to use the stuff in marine engines. Not sure why but it's what I have read.

 

Markheliops

I think you'll find that's because of the dreaded "diesel bug" - organic biomass that breeds in the fuel and forms black lumps and sludge which eventually block filters and pipes. What interests me is how long this will take to be a problem in the MV community, bearing in mind that the causes are fuel that has been subject to daily variations in temperature and stored for several months without use. Does that sound familiar? :undecided:

Andy

I think you'll find that's because of the dreaded "diesel bug" - organic biomass that breeds in the fuel and forms black lumps and sludge which eventually block filters and pipes. What interests me is how long this will take to be a problem in the MV community, bearing in mind that the causes are fuel that has been subject to daily variations in temperature and stored for several months without use. Does that sound familiar? :undecided:

 

Andy

You are dead right Andy. Microbiological growth is a problem in stagnant fuel ie fuel thats been sat a while. Also the FAME content in the fuel will also compound the problem. The best way to avoid it is to try and draw off water from the fuel..the bacteria thrives in the water that will build up over time and settle in the bottom of the tank. Also a full tank is better than half full as the air space will encourage condensation inside the tank. My TM suffered with this when I picked it up..the truck had been standing for 6 months with old fuel in it. It also happened to my mate with his boat when he bought some old gas oil..made a real mess of his filters and fuel system which resulted in serious power loss and we had to strip and clean the whole fuel system with treatment.

Im not 100% sure about heating oil as we dont deal with it though we have a lot of independant fuel companys that pick up GO10 and could well be delivering it for heating..when it goes out the gate its no longer my concern!!

Andy.

Andy, I thought that the main problems with sulphur were particulate formation and the creating of acid rain which was destroying the forests in Europe.

 

The downside is that the increased processing at refineries to make almost sulpur-free fuels uses more energy and these increases in CO2 emissions may offset to some extent the gains made in newer vehicles.

Hi Mike, Thats correct about the sulphur and acid rain. Im not involved in the refining process so I can't comment on that..but I can find out when im next back on shift! Its right on our doorstep..can't miss it!

Andy.

'Remember the good ol days of two, three & four star petrol & Smurfs.

:shocked::shocked::shocked::shocked::shocked:

Are we actually allowed to use the dreaded S word on this forum?

Mike

There are adatives that you can add to stored fuel to counter the bug problem,Ihave yoused these in bulk tanks feeding standby gen sets with good results.these may help with MVs parked over the winter .